Origin Story and Background of Global From Asia interviewed by Lorenzo Payman

This podcast episode was originally recorded for Lorenzo Payman’s “Leaders with a Heart” podcast. However, we thought it would be a valuable addition to the Global From Asia show as well.

In this episode, Lorenzo delves into Mike’s captivating origin story — exploring the reasons behind his move to China, the motivation driving the businesses he has founded, and the underlying purpose behind his entrepreneurial endeavors.

Thanks, Lorenzo, for having me! I appreciate the opportunity to be part of your podcast.

√ Lorenzo’s VIP Page
√ Leaders With A Heart
√ Cross Border Summit, Nov 15-17, 2023 – 2023.crossbordersummit.com
√ Visit our GFA partner –  Mercury  – for US banking solutons for your ecommerce businesss
√ Visit our GFA partner –  Casia Cross Better Logistics  – for your logistics needs

Thanks, Lorenzo and a heartfelt thank you to all the listeners for tuning in. Your support means the world!

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[00:00:00] Episode 418 of Global From Asia, origin story of Global From Asia. And of course I’m included in that part one with Lorenzo Payman. He’s interviewing me. Let’s tune in. Welcome to the Global From Asia podcast, where the daunting process of running an international business is broken down into straight up actionable advice.

And now your host, Michael Michelinie. All right, thank you [00:00:30] for choosing to watch or listen to I’m walking in a park global from Asia episode 418 the origin story of this show and the some of our events and cross border summits and Lorenzo’s a great host. He’s got his own podcast and this is Actually for his show, but he let me also use it for our show two weeks ago until cross border summit number five first in four years [00:01:00] November 15th will be a free expo trade show and then 16 17 is going to be our premium summit conference And we will be putting that all together in magical time and so but for this show We are going to be talking with Payman, or he’ll be talking to me, asking me questions.

We’ve done this a few times over the last ten years, where friends and guests and people in the community have interviewed me, so I will be [00:01:30] the, the guest, and he’ll be asking me questions. It’s actually quite a long one. About, you know, even the origin story of uh, the e commerce business in 2004, Wall Street, New York City, Uh, fraternity life, it’s a little bit more personal, he’s digging deep, you know, so.

I hope you enjoy, thanks for watching, and we also will have part 2 next week on fort19, where we talk more about what I’m doing now, so this is more like the past, [00:02:00] and then next week will be the future. After this, after this interview I’ll also talk about how I am walking in circles in the park and how that’s been helping me and maybe can help you.

I’ll share that that strategy or that tactic I’ve been doing. See you in the interview. Alright, we have Tommy, the sales manager at CrossBetter Logistics. How are you, Tommy? Hi, I’m fine. We just got to meet here in Shenzhen, China. It’s great, uh, they support the show at Global From [00:02:30] Asia and we also use them ourselves for many of our brands and e commerce businesses and Tommy really cares.

They always are, uh, trying to help us save money. You know, not, you have some products you keep for us in China. You have some products you keep for us in the U. S. warehouse and, uh, I really appreciate that. And you can talk to the seller, right? You can give them your advice. You work with many Chinese sellers a lot, right?

And you can help, um, help the [00:03:00] sellers understand more. Yeah, we are very professional for the shipment to USA and Canada. Also, we have warehouse in USA and Canada. We can help our factories, suppliers, sellers for the shipment. Yeah. For the e commerce business. Yep. You can even keep stuff in China too. So sometimes if you have the limitations about sending too much to Amazon, you can keep it here in China with, with, uh, Crossbetter or you can send it of course [00:03:30] to the US warehouse.

They have many different options and they’re always trying their best to find, uh, find out what’s the best solution for you. So definitely talk to Tommy, talk to Crossbetter and thank you for your support of the community. Yes, we have good pricing and better service. Yes. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much.

Greetings, everyone. This is Pamela LeadersLive podcast. Today, I have a very special guest to you, a guy that I’ve known for at least 10 years. I’ve been one of his followers on his podcast, [00:04:00] Global From Asia, since way back when, 2010, 2011, when I first went to Asia, before going to Asia. Well, I went to Asia first in 2010.

My first mini retirement, and then in 2012, I went to Hong Kong and Guangzhou. And that’s when I get really, really deep into e commerce. And when you searched back then, anything to do with e commerce, import export and Hong Kong and China, the first thing that will pop up was Michael Michelinie. That’s the person I’m talking to right here.

And when I moved to China in 2015, I went there as a football coach. And then I got into e [00:04:30] commerce, attended this event, met there. Yeah. And, and got to know each other. We did things together and over the years we, we got, you know, kept in touch. And now with his family is in Chiang Mai, Thailand. We met last year as well for Christmas.

We had a beautiful Christmas together last year. Yeah. And here I am. I’ve been meaning to, to bring him on my podcast for a long time, but, you know, timing and finally the stars aligned. They’re here where we are. This is going to be a very beautiful heart to heart conversation. We’re going to get, not only dive into his business, he’s [00:05:00] hosting another.

Major e commerce event very soon in Chiang Mai, but we’re going to talk about that later. But my, what I do in my podcast is to get to, to have a look under the hood, so to speak, to see what’s in your heart, to get to know who’s Mike as a person, as a man, as human being, first and foremost, before the businessman, because if, if mainly we don’t connect as, as person to person, I don’t care where you are.

We’re not going to talk a little on the business. So this is what I do my podcast. So anyways, without. Any further ado, Michael Brother, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me, buddy. It’s, it’s, [00:05:30] that was a great, I I really, yeah, I mean, your intro really hit home actually 10 years for the podcast.

Yes, as of a couple days ago. Wow. Yeah. How many episodes? Depends what you count is. ’cause I had like a subseries, I didn’t put in a main track, but about 412 shows as of right now. Maybe if you count some other ones, maybe four 50. Well, yeah, yeah, this is a guy that was one of the first guys that I started really following on [00:06:00] podcast.

And, you know, I’m not, you know, there’s that too. Once you start listening to someone after a few weeks, you tend to know the person, you know, you’ve never met them because you get to know the personality sense of humor. So when we finally met, what was it? The first time we met was in 2016 and Shenzhen at one of the meetups before the global from Asia.

Yeah. I remember that. Yeah. I remember that. It was like a different world, right? I mean, oh yeah. I feel like the world is a lot different since that. Oh yeah. Those times were [00:06:30] the funner times in China, I think. But I don’t know if we go that tangent, but staying on the positive, those times were really fun.

Yeah, those sort of times, you know, one of. One of my biggest regrets for the past 10 years was not going to China earlier. The first time I went was back in 2012 and I stayed just for a week or two and I came back to Canada and I, and now in retrospect, I wish I had gone back there and got into Amazon FP back in 2000, 12,013.

Yeah, I would’ve been a million, you know? But anyways, [00:07:00] myself, of course, I mean, we can all, I can we’ll get into Bitcoin back then, you know, any of. It’s insane world, but there’s always opportunities always. And you’re doing amazing things now. I’m so proud of you, man. It’s great. I’m on your show and you’ve been doing this three years and it’s amazing.

Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate that. You’re actually one of the inspiration on podcasting that really led me to get into podcasting. We’re actually, we did a podcast for a few, few weeks together. Remember that? Yeah, exactly. [00:07:30] The coffee and we had, yeah, I remember that’s what gave me my first experience with that.

But anyways, before we dive into all of that, for people who don’t know, you tell us who’s Michael McClainy. We’re going to talk about business and all that after, but as a man, as a person, as human being was Michael, you know, I was just another conference in Bangkok and people says I’m the hardest working person they know.

Oh yes. I, I think it was back since. You know, my, my [00:08:00] father, you know, he always wanted me to do more like, you know, I did good grades in school, sports jobs, Boy Scouts, it’s always. I guess I love to, but I feel like I’m more of a creator, more of maybe internet artist. You know, actually my middle name is Angelo.

I don’t know if you know that. I don’t know. Yes. Yeah. I think I sometimes mentioned it. I used to be more shy because when I was little, I got picked on for being like a ninja turtle, you know, but my grandmother was an artist. That’s how my, that’s [00:08:30] how I got my name. Michelangelo. Michelangelo. Yeah. You know, they didn’t put it as like my full first name is like Michael and an Angelo.

So yeah, I just feel like maybe I should even use that more as like I’m an internet artist creator. You know, I’m not like, of course, I’m not like a designer, right? I’m not like an art, like a graphics, but like you said, podcasts, blogs, videos, like I love to create and I feel like I’m a little bit introverted.

I know, you know, even you’ve given me some pep talks over the [00:09:00] years to, you know, talk myself up more. And, you know, I, I’m just, I don’t. I don’t like, I just like, I believe in creating, you know, I build stuff and I want those things to represent my, my value or my contribution. I don’t want to have to like tell people what I did or talk myself up.

But yeah, I mean, I’ve done a lot of things. I’ve done a lot of different, mostly within e commerce or cross border trade, you know, between China, Asia and overseas. [00:09:30] Especially during the coronavirus and the trade war. I was on all the different media companies. I don’t remember that like two or three years.

I was on like, overall of like Bloomberg Wall Street Journal, Yahoo Finance TV live, like talking about trade wars, talking about coronavirus. It was, it was a. You know, crazy time those few years, but yeah, no father, seven years old daughter, nine year old son in school, living in Chiang Mai, working at the home studio behind me in the [00:10:00] studio at the house.

Amazing wife, Chinese wife. I’m a wife from China. Like she’s Chinese. I don’t say it the wrong way, but she’s also hardworking person. She’s doing her business now. I’ve been supporting. And I don’t know, is that enough? Or I mean, I can go on, you know, to be honest, you know, that’s one thing that I’m the same as you.

I don’t like to talk about myself, but sometimes you just have to let people know who you are. Don’t, don’t, don’t [00:10:30] minimize your achievements and don’t, don’t play, don’t play small. It’s not like you’re boasting. You’re just stating facts. So it’s okay. Another thing that I want to add about you, you’re one of the biggest connectors.

You love connecting, hosting events. So yeah, so that’s something that he hosts, you’re hosting back then. Probably the biggest e commerce event after the content fair and the, what is it, global source? What is it, uh, in Hong Kong? It was, uh, yeah, the Global Sources Summit was, was [00:11:00] happening there. With those events, your events, the, you know, Global From Asia was some of the biggest, because you were inviting some of the biggest names in the industry.

Yeah. So yeah, cross border summit, yeah, I got one of the signs behind me and yeah, that was really like the high times, you know, of, of the industry and community and, and yeah, I mean, I love, yeah, connecting people, you know, like. I try, especially at an in person event, but even [00:11:30] online, I, I try my best to connect people to think who’s the right person for this person to meet.

And yeah, so Mike, before we start, what I usually do, I like to ask a series of rapid fire questions to further get to know you as a person. Ready? Sure. Ready. All right. What makes you happy as a person?

Seeing people, you know, taking action and making things happen, especially if it’s [00:12:00] something I had to do with, like, you know, even hearing you do said you were inspired by the podcast and doing this, that that’s amazing, man, that I love. Yeah. When I was, when I was back. Can at home back in 2011, 12, especially after I came back from Hong Kong, you know, daydreaming obsessed on how can I come return back to China long term.

The podcast, I was consuming podcasts about that nonstop. And back then it was not like all the podcasts you have now. The only good podcast back then about China was global [00:12:30] from, from Asia. Yours. I was binge listening your episode nonstop. And yeah, so this was a source of inspiration for me back then.

Great. Okay. Cool. What makes you smile? Well, I mean, any, any parent now, I think would say just like my kids now, like even I’m, you know, definitely my kids. is top one. And the second is, yeah, I [00:13:00] mean, seeing other, other people, you know, growing and developing and taking, taking action similar, maybe to the first one, but yeah, my kids for sure now.

So now what makes you become alive? What sets your soul on fire? What makes your heart sink in a positive way? Let’s take the happiness a couple of notches higher. Okay. Yeah. I love to develop, develop my team. I mostly have people in the Philippines working with us. And I love to be able to, [00:13:30] I don’t want to advertise it too much, but sometimes I’ve, I’ve lent, I’ve lent them money to them when they needed it, not now.

And they pay back over time as a, like a loan and it helps them. And, you know, of course they’re very thankful and, and it was, it really makes me happy. I’m able to do that. Yeah. Wow. You want multiple or one? I mean, that’s the one that just popped my mind. That’s fine. And that’s fine. That’s fine. I want, I mean, you’re the, you’re the, you’re the [00:14:00] star.

I’m the host. However, the show is about making you shine, whatever you want to share, however much within limits, because it’s a fire, a fireside question, you know, but anyways, up to you, brother. Great. Okay. Now on the other side of the spectrum, what makes you sad and angry? Oh, you know, when I feel like I give someone advice and they, they don’t have to listen, but [00:14:30] maybe there’s something like I could have gone to help someone and it didn’t work out.

Sure. Yeah. What would you say is your number one personal superpower? Can you say that again? What’d you say? What would you say is your number one personal superpower? You know, I’ve been doing Pomodoro’s for maybe eight years. And I feel like I’m really able to do a lot [00:15:00] of different things well, which people don’t often agree with me on, but I, I can switch my focus between different things pretty, pretty smoothly.

I remember one thing I will never forget one time back in Hong Kong. We were going to global sources. We’re going, we’re staying together at Lucien. We’re going on the Metro, on the subway, you were with your laptop. It was packed rush hour. We were still, Mike was still typing. That’s a, that’s image. I can never [00:15:30] remove from my, that shows how much hardworking and work ethic you have.

I mean, that’s wow. I don’t know how to tell me, but hats off to your brother for that. Remember that? Yeah, I do. I do that a lot. You know, I have some people take photos at trade shows and maybe it was like that on a train too, but I’m standing at key. There’s not even a seat. So I’m just kind of crouched down and I’m my laptop on my thigh and I’m like working like this.[00:16:00]

Like, not like a short term, but like writing along, you know, like writing up stuff, working on stuff. Yeah. Honestly, that motivates me. I don’t know what’s crazy. It’s almost like, it’s almost like doing your homework the night before to just do right or exam or cramming, but I kind of get that in my mind.

Like I just try to push myself to do it now. Yeah, absolutely. When was the last time that you had a really, [00:16:30] really, really good laugh, the type that gives you. Your cheeks are hurting, your stomach is hurting because of laughing. You know, I guess it’s whatever pops my mind, but there was a, a friend. Almost crying because you’re, yeah, you’re, you’re laughing so much.

Yeah. My friend Vlad, he was talking about these crazy stories he had when he was in China, trying to buy from a factory and he was very animated. You know, we’re at like a coffee shop and it was loud. And there’s like, obviously [00:17:00] people, random people near us that were listening and laughing, but he’s talking about how he went to lunch and the guy, the factory owner made him get, you know, didn’t make, but, you know, got him drunk and they got drunk.

And then somehow. The glass broke on the factory owner’s hands and he got blood and then it was like going on and on. It was like the funniest story. Like, he said he had to carry him on his on his back because he passed out and he had blood [00:17:30] and it was getting on. He had a suit because he. He thought he had to wear a suit to impress the factory owner.

He says he’s getting blood on his suit. He tries to put him into a taxi and the taxi doesn’t want him because he’s got this bloody passed out Chinese factory owner. So he’s like walking him on his back, back to the factory in the hot heat of Shenzhen. And it was the funniest story, you know, he’s, and then he says, He didn’t know what to tell the factory company.

And he put the guy back on his factory chair, [00:18:00] you know, in his office, a big, those big Chinese desks and chairs. And he puts them down and the guy’s like, like passed out in his chair. And he like. So he leaves, you know, like that, that was one of, and he’s really, really animated and loud and there’s all these people looking at him and us and, and I couldn’t stop laughing.

I was cracking up. I, I, that, that was the craziest. [00:18:30] I hope you have someone to record that, you know, no, that’s probably better. Not record. Well, this is recorded, but yeah, that was, wow. You’re making me laugh now. I’m having like, it’s hurting my job because I’m laughing too much. That’s a good one. All right.

What is one thing that you use the value that you don’t value anymore? One thing, one principle, whatever. Well, definitely like, [00:19:00] You know, maybe I’ll maybe it’s part of getting older or maturing. Maybe you can reflect, but I don’t material things. I mean, I don’t know if it’s between covid even before living in Asia, like traveling a lot.

Like, I don’t really want physical things, you know, like I tried almost, I try to not even accept even if they’re gifts or like swag or whatever. Like I, I don’t want to get bogged down with stuff anymore. You know, I agree. Especially during COVID, I had to like leave stuff in different countries because I had to evacuate and [00:19:30] I, you know, so now I’m just trying to not to travel so light, you know, I try to travel carry on.

I try to not. Absolutely. Yeah. So for sure, that’s, that’s, especially when you’re kids, you know, like I have kids, they want toys, they want to show off things. Maybe that’s a natural thing as you get older. I don’t know what do you say, but I used to care about things. Now I really don’t care. I’m with you on that.

Absolutely. I’m trying to. Get back my life [00:20:00] and just one carry on in my backpack. That’s it. Yeah. On the other side, what is one thing that you didn’t value before that you’re now valuing? Well, I mean, it’s not like I didn’t value health or sleep. Like, you know, I used maybe sleep is more, but I guess sleep and health are related.

Right. But sleep, you know, I, I don’t want to pick on him. I was really inspired a lot by Gary Vee, but there were some times and it made some of this content where he said, you don’t need to sleep. You don’t need to sleep. [00:20:30] You sleep when you’re dead. You got to hustle. You got to hustle. You got to hustle.

Remember? I think he stopped doing that in his later videos, but I was watching a lot of his stuff. And like around when you were talking about 2015, 16, and he had his vlogs and videos and you don’t need to I sleep four hours a night and I I work all day and I hustle and I build businesses and I’m a millionaire and you can do the same thing.

And I, I tried to follow that and it killed me, man. I really tried like four or five hours. [00:21:00] It killed me. I was, maybe he can do it or others can do it, but I need my, like, I actually, right now I’ll be a little bit honest. I didn’t sleep well last night. I got like maybe six. Six and a half and I feel it right now, even honestly, my energy is lower.

So sleep is so important to me. You know, like I used to be younger. I think I can just like do coffees or just push through, but now I want to have good sleep. Absolutely. You know, we mentioned sleep. I think Gary Vee should write the [00:21:30] book just like Tim Ferriss, not the firework week, but the firework sleep week, you know?

Yeah, forward night. Come on. You’re slacker. How about four hour a week? Yeah, it’s true, right? I mean, it’s, you know, and then I guess maybe the second is I still, unfortunately, I still do value, but I should value less what other people think of me, right? I think, you know, me, if you try giving that feedback, I care about what [00:22:00] people think.

And of course, I don’t, I don’t like it. It’s not like I, I’m an a hole, like, I’m, it’s not like I want to do bad things to people, but I, you know, somebody, I might worry they’re going to think this or that because I did this or that, right? And I, I still, I got to value what they think less and less, and I’m trying, and I still do care, unfortunately, especially those people that don’t matter.

No offense to that person, but might not matter as much. But you know, you, I know what you mean. I’ve been the same before and it’s been a massive [00:22:30] struggle, but finally learning because it’s all about putting the most important thing. One thing I keep hearing is the most important person in life is yours.

That’s not being selfish. That’s being altruistic because you need to be the best version of you. Fill your cup first so you can give back. If you have nothing left, if you’re not your best, you’re not going to be of any use. So it’s okay to put yourself first. That’s something I’ve been learning the hard way.

It’s been tough, but something I had to learn. Yeah. Agreed. Let’s [00:23:00] move. Let’s move forward. You like traveling, right? Yeah. I love it. All right. We can’t do an entire show on traveling, but we’ll do that another time. For now, I want to take it down a different type of traveling, down the memory line. Go back to when you were a young boy growing up, you know, when we were kids, people around us, parents, relatives, neighbors, friends, teachers, always ask us, Hey Mike, what do you want to become when you grow up?

What does your answer to that as a young boy? It kind of evolved. I used to say [00:23:30] artist, you know, like a painter artist. I remember that for a while I think, you know, maybe young boy. Yeah, like elementary school. I thought artist Most of the time in high school, I, I remember saying business and I remember having arguments.

I went to a Catholic high school, had arguments with a few of the, not the nuns or the sisters about what classes I needed. But I’d say like my grade schools was artists and then my high school was my own business.[00:24:00]

So growing up, what was your relationship with school? Did you love school or did you hate school? Well, kind of like I was just saying some parts I loved and if I didn’t feel like it was relevant, I was very difficult in that class. And, you know, I remember Mr. G, he was one of the teachers, Mr. G, Mr. G. I appreciate the guy, but, you know, he had a couple of [00:24:30] classes.

He was more like philosophy and like maybe even religion because we had a religious. It was, and I would kind of ask him questions that would always challenge his, I would ask why, you know, cause he would teach something like this happened or, and I would just usually have like short questions, like, kind of like why, or, you know, like short ones that were hard for him to answer or was always contesting what he was teaching us.

So one day he’s like, Mike, can you, Michael, can you speak to me after class, stay, stay after class, speak with me. [00:25:00] And he’s like, why are you so confrontational? Why can’t you just, you know, I just said, I don’t need this. I don’t need this class. I don’t, I wish I could out that no offense to you, but I don’t need this class.

And he’s saying like, and I do that to chemistry too. So the more he was just saying, you’re just very confrontational. And then my sister, Christine, she says, by the end of this semester, you’re going to memorize the whole periodic table of elements. And she pulls down that chart, you know, [00:25:30] pulls it down, you know, and you’re going to know all the numbers, the letters, the weights.

We’re going to go row by row, column by column, like, you know, like atomic weights, atomic numbers. Yeah. I just wrote, I see him. I raised my hand. She’s like, yes, Michael. Hi. Why? That was my only, and so she’s like, okay, Michael, I don’t appreciate your attitude. Talk to me after class. So [00:26:00] after class, she’s like, why, why are you doing that?

Why are you like this? I said, I don’t want to. I don’t believe the best use of our time is to memorize a pure table of elements for three or six months or whatever it was. She’s like, what do you want to do when you grow up? I said, I want to start my own business. I didn’t even know what kind of business, but I thought I wanted to like, I remember in high school, like, this is like junior year.

I knew I wanted to do my own business. She’s like, well, one day. There is going to be nobody in the office, [00:26:30] and something’s going to spill on the floor, and you’re going to need to clean it, and you’re going to open up the cabinet under the sink, and you’re going to take the wrong chemical, and another chemical, you’re going to mix it, and you’re going to create a fire.

And I was like, I was like, because I didn’t memorize the periodic table of elements in junior year of high school. Worst example of for a reason. And then I said, sister, Amy, she was, [00:27:00] she was one, she’s in college now. And I still talk to her a little bit. She says in, in the exams, they give you this piece of paper for a resource during your exam.

They don’t make you memorize it in college. And then she says, well, that might be the case, but you still need to know it to save time from looking at it during the exam. So it’s, it’s, it’s a, I was like, you know, like, but of course there are some classes like I liked, like, I liked more like logical ones, like one of my favorite classes was [00:27:30] thermodynamics, which I didn’t expect to like.

But I liked it because it was logical. It was input equals output. So it was like a game. You’re like putting in this stuff and it goes through these processes and this is what comes out and you can kind of figure it out. Like I like like puzzles or, you know, but I didn’t like memorizing. I really, really hated memorizing.

Yeah, I can see that. Imagine if you were in the same class in grade 10, 11, what kind of kid were you, were you like the shy one, [00:28:00] the chatterbox, the life of the party, the superstar athlete? What kind of kid were you? So I, I was, I was, I guess you could say, I don’t know, it sounds weird, but politician. I should, I won the class president every year in high school.

And then when I ran in college. I think I only did it as a freshman and sophomore, but I also won freshman and sophomore class president. And I remember running in freshman of high school, I went to a Catholic school, my parents didn’t want me to go to public school because they said it was dangerous and I [00:28:30] sell drugs or something like this, so they didn’t want me to go to public school.

Yeah, they, they thought that I, cause I was a networker, right? Like you said, connector. So they were afraid I was going to like sell drugs or something or whatever, I guess. So I’ll go to high school and I don’t know anybody, nobody, you know, I’m sitting in the gym at the opening day and people, I felt like they were talking about my shoes or something and laughing at me from the back row, I think, but they, a lot of the kids knew each other.

They like came from the [00:29:00] same elementary school. This was like the high school. They it was like a group. And, you know, it’s like the 1st or 2nd week. They’re like, okay, who’s the run for president? Who’s the run for president? Uh, you know, please, you got to fill out this paper and submit it before. Uh, I don’t know.

You know what I’m saying? Like, you had to fill out some paper and give it to the teacher or put in a box or whatever. And, I remember this so clearly. I won’t say his name, but his name is also Mike. There’s lots of Mikes, as you can imagine. And, I think he’s sitting in front of me. I’m sitting here in the second or [00:29:30] third row.

He turns around and he’s like, he sees me filling out the paper. He’s like, you’re gonna run for class president? Nobody knows you. And Leslie, or whatever her name is, She’s like, she’s going to win. She’s running and, and her brother’s like the best basketball player in junior, in junior class. So everybody likes her brother.

Everybody knows her. Nobody knows you. Nobody’s going to vote for you. He’s saying [00:30:00] this to me, like, you know how he’s turning back, right? You notice those old school chair desks, right? So he’s got the, it’s like the metal one piece chair. He’s like, so he’s yeah. He’s like sliding like this saying like, you shouldn’t even bother.

Nobody’s going to vote for you. There’s a popular girl. Everybody likes is going to vote for Iran. And I made posters that says it was this uncle Sam. You know what the point the finger and it says do what’s right vote for Mike[00:30:30]

and I was putting them up on the different parts of the school and then I was putting them up on the on the walls and this actually very she was very attractive charismatic sophomore girl Bridget and she was kind of she saw me like hustling like, you know, nobody knew me and I’m putting posters up on this during the during the class break or whatever.

And she’s like, And then she’s like, you’re running for president of freshman class. I’m like, yeah. And then she’s like, [00:31:00] your name is Michael McElhinney. And I was like, yeah, she’s like, and she’s like screaming it out. Like, she’s like, let’s go. And she’s like, vote for Mike, vote for Mike. And then she’s, she was kind of like popular in her sophomore class.

So she’s getting her other. Girlfriends like all like chanting it in the halls, like up and down the halls in the, in the high school and, and you know, so who, you know, there’s only one president of, at least in our school for each, each class, right? Freshman, sophomore. So I think there’s maybe [00:31:30] another contestant, or maybe it was just the two of us.

Who do you think, who do you think won? Well, I think I kind of said it, but. You won. What did that guy do? The one that said, what do you think he, so it’s an interesting story. I didn’t win. We exactly tied exact votes with that guy. The girl. No, he didn’t run. He was just a peanut. He was a peanut gallery. He just says, I was gonna lose the, the, the popular girl.

I like that. He was just saying, oh, don’t even bother. She’s so popular. She’s gonna win. [00:32:00] Don’t even try. He wasn’t competing with me. He was just saying, Oh, Mike, who knows? Nobody knows. You don’t even bother. So, no, it was exact time. And they said they counted and counted and counted and they couldn’t find.

They were always exactly like, whatever the number was exactly. So we were a co president. Oh, wow. Yeah, we were both presidents. And then here’s the craziest story. The family moved out of the town, the brother to fame, the popular [00:32:30] brother and her or she school something. They left the school. I can’t remember the exact reason.

And I became the only president universe working for you. Yeah, so that’s kind of me. You know, I think I feel like I’m still the same. As that’s I think, you know, me, I’m trying to be neutral. I try to like be friendly as many people as I can. You know, another thing when they sign the shirts on the back of your shirt on, at least in our school with the, the last day of senior year in high school.

And this one [00:33:00] girl Lorraine or something, she says, don’t change. You’re like the nicest guy. Don’t change for anybody. People try to change you. They’re going to tell you. And she says, don’t change for anybody.

So, yeah, I mean, honestly, it’s still true, but then they try to change me in college. I was in a fraternity. So of course, fraternities try to change you. And I worked on wall street. They try to change me. They’re like, you’re too nice. You’re too nice. That’s what the [00:33:30] fraternity guys would say, Michelangelo, you ninja turtle get on my face.

Yeah. So they tried to. You’re a chill like a villain. Maybe people will try to change me at this conference, but you know, I don’t know.

Everybody is trying to mold you the way they want you to be now. Yeah, I guess that’s maybe that’s human nature, right? Yeah, it’s all about influence. I was trying to [00:34:00] influence you and all that. But anyways, so last question about your, your days in school, especially high school and beyond. Were you popular with the ladies?

I would say so. You know, I mean. I, you know, I, I still, I was like a little bit of a geek, especially in high school. I was a little bit more shy, but of course I was in soccer and I, you know, I, I kept, you know, in good shape or health and they would like me and they would, or certain girls would be crushed with [00:34:30] me.

And then there was some, but I was really, honestly, the other reason is I was so focused on my work. I didn’t, I didn’t want to get distracted with girls too much because. I was, I was in school. I was even doing extra classes at night at a community college to use for my college when I went to freshman year, I was in soccer and baseball and boy scouts and, uh, work part time at a grocery store.

So I was really afraid that a [00:35:00] girlfriend would distract me, but of course there was, um, some encounters, but I, usually they wouldn’t like last because they would start to say, you care about your lot, your school, your work more than me. It was a lot of times they’re comparing. Competing, right? They feel like, so, yeah, but I mean, I would, you know, I was like the kind of like Shire, uh, busy kid that certain girls would, you know, like, Shire Casanova.[00:35:30]

No, that’s cool. That’s cool. Um, Let’s move forward, you know, from the moment you left school to now, how would you describe your path? Would you say it was pretty much straightforward smooth sailing once you get to one lane? You were set for life or more like turns and twists like a roller coaster. I kind of know the answer But I want you to say it.

Yeah, I guess you know the answer You know, like I’ve written a few books myself and you know Even before I wrote them the people I met in my [00:36:00] life would feel like you’re living your life like a book You know, like you’re like not living like a normal life. That’s what some of my friends would tell me about But yeah, I mean, this is anything but easy and I’ve definitely still got a long way to go before I can say I made it, but I, uh, I went to engineering school because my parents and the nuns wanted me to go be an engineer.

I didn’t want to go to engineering college. So they’re like, Oh, I said, I want to start my own business. They said, Oh, you got to [00:36:30] get in technical degree, undergrad and MBA, and then you can start your own business. So I, I believe that, you know, this is like the nineties, the late nineties. So I believe that.

So I thought I had to go to technical college work, save money for an MBA, go to MBA class, get an MBA, and then could start my own business. I really thought that was my path. I think I even have like one of those school projects where you had to draw [00:37:00] that your milestones plan your life. You ever did those?

You, I swear, I think I said like, get good job, you know, go to good college, get a good job, get MBA, start my own business. I think it was something like that. I think even in my like 10 teams, like early, even maybe 12, 11, something, I think I remember showing my mom that. I don’t know how old I was, but so I, I didn’t want to do, I didn’t want to be an engineer.

So I, I went against the grain and I interviewed an [00:37:30] investment bank, Deutsche Bank for, for first for tech. And then I said in the interview, I don’t want to do technology. I want to move to the trading floor. I want to work on the trading floor. I want to do the business side. I don’t want to do the IT side.

You know what the guy says? He says. You know, I’m the hiring manager for the IT department. I’m not the hiring manager. Oops.

I’m shooting yourself on the [00:38:00] foot. And I mean, I didn’t know, I knew that too, but I felt like, what can I do? I’m trying, they wouldn’t let me apply for that. They said you can only apply for the IT. So I, I remember the HR is mostly women, at least in that. Company was like three or four HR. They’re really nice.

I think I did the summer program at Deutsche Bank with them and they were trying me full time job and they said, what you said that to him. You’re crazy. And you know, the craziest was they called me back two or three weeks [00:38:30] later. They said, Oh, actually, I don’t. You know, they were really impressed with your interview, you know, and a day we decided to give you a final round interview in the trading department.

So they let me interview and I got an interview at the trading side of Deutsche Bank in Manhattan, New Jersey. Yeah, I guess they liked it because I said it straight up to them and I’ve been straight up to a lot of there’s so many stories like that where I’m [00:39:00] straight. I’m straight to these people. I could go on a few more in my career at Deutsche Bank.

I almost got people thought I was gonna get fired. Like, like, it was like the first week of the orientation and the head of the I. T. Department because I was I was actually in the middle office. To be honest, I wasn’t. Of Trader. I was a trading assistant. So I was between tech and the trading department.

That was my job. So I was also in a technology field still. And so the head of the it of New York came to speak to the new hires. [00:39:30] And there was a big tech problem with the integration of their software and the trading side, and it was always causing problems and it fucked. Sorry, I, it messed up my, it messed up my work all the time and we had penalties from the, whatever these, you know, NASDAQ, NASD and the New York exchange.

Cause it was like late filing and late reporting or change tickets. So I raised my, he actually was really cocky. This guy, he brought his trophies. [00:40:00] He brought trophies and put them on the table at the front of the room. He’s like, I’ve won all these it awards for my software, like really all about him and how great he is and how great the software is.

And I raised my hand. He’s like, Oh yes, you, yes. In the back or whatever. I said, your software is the biggest problem in my job right now. And we’re losing a lot of money and everybody’s complaining about it all the time. And, and [00:40:30] you know, man, like everybody, there’s like 80 people, everybody’s like, you’re fucking, you’re dead, man.

You are done. Like, goodbye. You know, like, this is like the head of the IT, you know, and you’re telling him his software sucks for everybody. Who’s that guy, an intern? Say that to me. Wow. You know, he, he asked me to talk to after and he says, thank you. Cause most people don’t have the courage to say there’s something wrong.

And I didn’t know there [00:41:00] was a problem. I didn’t know nobody says it to me. Nobody says it to me. So I’m glad you said something to me. Can you set up a special department? You can get some of the other interns or people in other departments and you put together like a group of four or five people and, and, and help me get to the bottom of this problem.

Wow. And I took two or three other new hires and they were shocked. I remember this one, she was really cute. I think Argentinian or Latin American [00:41:30] girl, they hired, maybe from Peru. So, you know, she’s, and she had the Spanish accent. Cause she’s like, she was really, she’s sitting next to me or in front of me.

And she’s like,

so I think that’s universal. I went to the bar after, you know, happy hour. And they’re like, Oh, you’re here still. And I told him and they were like, wow. And then I got her and a couple others. And we had these like special department, uh, for a while, but I was stuff like that. And, um, [00:42:00] but I wanted to, you know, I thought I’d want to get an MBA.

I thought I had to get an MBA. So I started saving my money, saving my money. Eating peanut butter on the floor, getting laughed at because I’m eating peanut butter and jelly on Wall Street, New York. And I didn’t care. I would buy, I would make peanut butter and jelly for the whole week. I put them in plastic bags in my refrigerator and every morning I’ll take it to lunch and I eat that.

I wouldn’t pay the 12, 15 lunch. You know, I would use the free coffee from the, the canteen. I didn’t buy the [00:42:30] Starbucks or the whatever coffee. And I saved it. You know what I called the E Trade savings money market. I had like a four or 5 percent interest on money market. I nicknamed it the FU fund. Nice.

Yeah. Love that. And it got up to like 80, 000 in a couple of, in maybe five years. And, and, uh, you know, I, I quit and in 2007, and I remember [00:43:00] these, these guys, you know, they’re like almost like fraternity, right? But they’re like, you’re going to be begging for your job back in a month. And then another guy’s like, nah, I think he can maybe.

He’s got savings. He’ll probably come back in six months. No, no, he’ll come back in three months. Oh, yeah. I’ll bet you they’re like betting in front of me about how long it’s going to be until I come back for my job. If you know, like, Oh, I’ll put in a hundred bucks on that. And they’re like making a book, you know, like a, like a, like a betting book in front of me.

It was like, how long I’m going to [00:43:30] last before I beg for my job back. And then I said, don’t worry, I’m going to IPO this. And I remember the guy specifically Patrick, and he’s like, Oh, please let me know so I can make sure to get enough short out short position as soon as I can.

Wow. Why, why did you quit that job? You were, you were on, on a trajectory to, to be set for life, you know, working in a big [00:44:00] bank and Yeah, I made over a hundred thousand a year and I was like 23, 24 years old, and I was saving a lot. Yeah. I was so sad. When I was taking the antidepressants, I was seeing a psychiatrist.

I, I, I went to, I remember I went to a psychiatrist in like right off of New York Wall Street, like on Water Street, on a high build, you know, she’s got the nice view and I’m sitting in her office and she’s like. Why are you not happy? You’re making so much money. You live in New York City. There’s so many, you know, like nightlife things you can do with [00:44:30] beautiful girls, etc, etc, which I did have.

I was having fun. I was also selling on eBay. I, you know, I was selling on my website, New York bar store. I think you know about my first e com business doing that. I don’t know. I mean, and then she prescribed me some kind of antidepressants, and I felt kind of like a failure. I remember, and I think she could see I wasn’t sad about that, and she’s like, Oh, don’t worry.

It’s like they might as well put this stuff in the tap [00:45:00] water in the water in New York because everybody’s on this. Don’t worry. That’s what she says and she gives me the prescription to go get the pills. And, you know, and then, Um, Yeah, I just felt like, you know, and it just didn’t seem like it made sense.

Like I remember it was like 2006 and I was on wall street and I was looking at the training floor and I was like, you’re a red, you’re a red, you’re a red pick. You’re a red color. You’re a green, you’re a red, you’re a green, you’re a red, you’re a green. [00:45:30] Like you’re just, you are not needed. You’re going to get turned into an algorithm, a system, the bank doesn’t care about any of you.

You guys are just temporary humans until they get some machine to replace you. My job is replaceable. I was getting paid a lot of money. My job was I had to get ham, cheese and egg on our bacon, egg and cheese on a roll. And then sometimes I had to, like, clean their tie at the dry cleaner and get a new shirt.

And then I had to, like, [00:46:00] fight people on the phones about trades and, you know, like, get yelled at. And you know, sometimes they’ll throw the phone at me and like take out their anger at me. Cause I was like the trading assistant. Like I had, I worked on Bloomberg terminal and I just got, they would just like, I was like the punching bag.

I can go through it. If you want to hear some of those stories I could go through, but, uh, Oh yes, that’s fascinating. So one of my favorites. Well, it’s not my worst [00:46:30] memories, you know, basically I didn’t, I could put trades, but because I had a license, but I was like a relayer. So they would put it on a piece of paper, right?

They’d write it on and they’d throw it on. Even if I was in front of them, they’d write it and throw it on the floor. Anyway, they wouldn’t hand it to me. They’d throw it in front of me on the floor to pick up. You know, so one time they call me shadow, they call me shadow because I was quiet and fast and probably, you know, [00:47:00] nice, right?

And so they want me to book the trades fast as possible because once I put it into the computer, it would show on the stock market, right? It would show, cause I did bonds. It was distressed bonds, very illiquid. It’s not like stocks. It’s like, it’s, it’s, you know, I think you understand. I don’t want it. So it’s like more human entered, at least in that time.

So he, he throws a piece of paper on the floor and I pick it up real fast. And then, and then I’m walking back to his, his desk, the trader, man, he’s [00:47:30] got the phone, you know, those phones with like the, the, the, the shoulder thing. It’s like a black phone at the long cable. And he’s like, yeah, you can hear, you can hear somebody yelling at him.

You can hear somebody like, you try to rip me off, you’re ripping me off. And he’s like, got this. And he’s sitting low, you know, they always sit low under their computer like this, and he’s like this. And he’s looking at one of his screens. And he sees my trade ticking like, and it shows the price and what was happening was he was, he, he bought it for like, I don’t know, let’s just say 10 cents on a dollar.

He’s [00:48:00] selling it for 15 cents on a dollar, something like this. I don’t know. He had a really wide spread. So I think he didn’t want me to put that first one in until he put both because then I put both. I didn’t know and he’s always yelling at me. I’m too slow or whatever. So the guy is yelling on the phone.

He doesn’t even hang up the phone. The guy is still yelling. He just stands up and he’s like a, he’s like a football player from like Princeton or like Yale, like this really elite basketball, no, a football [00:48:30] player guy, like six something, right? Huge guy. These guys are like, gets up, stands over me. Like I’m, you know, I’m five eight, you know, you know, he stands over me like this and he’s like, did you put that trade into books?

On the, on the terminal? I’m like, And everybody shut up. And he’s loud in my face. Everybody shut up. It’s like a huge floor, right? This, I’m talking like football field size. And he’s like, did you, did you answer my question? Did you put that trade in? [00:49:00] Did you put that trade in? Of course you gotta add some f words into there.

I don’t want to say it on this. Yeah. And then I’m like, I don’t know. Yeah, I did. You locked me five. Jeez, you mother. And all like this in my face. That I lost some 5, 000 on his trade and yeah, like that. So then they implemented the bell. So they, they had like those ding, ding, ding, ding, like hotel bells. [00:49:30] So that was my bell.

So when they wanted me to put the tray to go, so I, I started getting some, you know, I started to get a little, you know, I started to get pushback. So I took it, you know, there’s sometimes a janitor walking up and down the trading floor, cleaning up the garbage. You know, cleaning up, I took that thing and went, and I spanked, I spiked it into the garbage can, just, you know, the huge rolling garbage can thing that the, the like guy was cleaning up.

And then they’re like, [00:50:00] Oh, shadow, you don’t like that bell. You got it. We still need a bell. You gotta go, go find another bell, you know, go to like staples and get a bell. You know, so pick one

you like. And so, yeah, like I, I got the other bell. And it was like a, like a tea time bell. And so there was a girl I really, I did, I had this kind of crush and she was really a, [00:50:30] you know, hot, you know, you think in New York, like, you know, like black, straight hair, like maybe she’s Italian, like tan, like, well defined, you know, also like nice smile, nice person.

And it was hard for me to have the courage to talk to her. She’s on another kind of area of the trading floor. And I think finally I had the courage to talk to her one day. Afternoon, like, you know, two or three o’clock in the afternoon, I’m going by her and I started talking to her and I was talking about something like, oh, there’s some happy hour tonight.

You going there [00:51:00] on the other side, you know, and then calling you. Yeah, I’m like talking to her. And she’s like, are they calling you? I’m like, I don’t know. I don’t know. Shadow! Shadow! D d d! Shadow! And then he’s like, cause he’s low under, they’re all low under their desks, you know? So he’s like, D d d! Where are you?

Shadow! Shadow! Ha ha [00:51:30] ha! That’s wild. I’m like and there’s no hiding it because they you know, get over here. Stop hitting on that girl. You like her And I’m calling it by your name. It’s like a shadow.

And you know, those guys, they never had the courage to talk to any girls, you know, I mean, they were making way more than me or make their millionaires, but they, they had no, so they’re another time. We’re down in some Irish pub like McLeanies or something, Glories, whatever, and like [00:52:00] down off Wall Street, like in a basement and it was like maybe earlier that time, four or five.

And there was a group of beautiful girls on the other side and those guys are saying, Oh, these girls are beautiful. And there’s not that many other people in the bar yet. I shadow, I got balls and I got courage to go talk to them. So I get up and I go over, I go over there and I’m talking to them and they’re talking to me and they’re like, oh, you know, yeah.

[00:52:30] Shadow! And the girls, you know, they’re like these New York girls or Jersey girls are like, are they talking to you? Is he talking to you? You know, like, you know, like I don’t know who those guys are. I don’t know. I don’t, they’re not talking to me, but they’re like, ain’t nobody else around here. Ain’t nobody else.

Just us. I’m like, I don’t know, maybe he’s, maybe he’s like the waiter or something? I don’t know, like, Yeah, shut up! Why [00:53:00] are you got the girls now and you forgot about us, huh? You got the girls, you forgot about your boys, huh? You’re just thinking about the girls, huh? Yeah, huh? I was like, oh, this is emotion, man.

I was like that all the time. All the time. And we need to do an episode with just stories, fun stories, wild stories from the time in New York, but also from the [00:53:30] time in China. Yeah, I mean, there’s so many stories. Yeah, so I finally quit that. And then, you know, another story is I thought, I still thought it was actually the ADGs I saved, I thought it was going to be for my MBA.

And still wasn’t probably enough, because those things are… I don’t know how much, but I, so I started taking those Kaplan prep tests. The Kaplan, you got to like, you don’t have to, but it helps you get your GMATs. Cause you need the good GMATs to go to the good MBA school, right? So it’s Kaplan, GMAT, MBA school.[00:54:00]

So I signed up, I think the bank paid for the prep classes for me or something. So I signed up for the night class. I go into the night class. Hey everybody, thanks for signing up for the Kaplan GMAT prep test. Today we’re going to just get to know each other a little bit more. Can you say your name and where you work and what do you want to do with your MBA?

Hi, I’m Joe. I work at Lehman and I want to get an MBA so I can get a raise. Hi, I’m Gene. I work at Goldman Sachs and I want to get it so I can get a VP position. Hi, I’m Joe and I work at [00:54:30] Merrill Lynch and I want to get it so I can get a raise. I want a promotion. I want a raise. I want a VP. I want to be a VP.

And the whole thing was like that. Hi, I’m Mike Michelini. I work at Deutsche Bank and I want to get an MBA so I can start my own business. Everybody was like, who is this guy? Why is he in here? And then I was like, I don’t even know if I lasted the whole first class because they’re like, okay, thanks for all the intros.

Let’s start to prepare. Okay, now we’re going to do the geometry. Let’s [00:55:00] go over the circumference of a circle. Okay. And you know, I was like, how do we get the area of a triangle? Okay, everybody. And then I was like, man, this is some bullshit, man. I’m not going to do this. You know, and I think I don’t want to say I walked out, but I don’t, I definitely didn’t come back or I, I don’t know, I can’t, I felt, you know, me, I feel a little bit bad because, you know, the company had paid for it, but I think I can’t remember if I walked out right away or I finished that one or I, maybe I came to one or two more, but I definitely didn’t finish that [00:55:30] prep tests and classes.

Did you get the money back? Did you get the money refunded for the course? I think I didn’t care, unfortunately, because the company paid, they would reimburse or whatever. And I don’t think they would have anyway. Right. I mean, but I’m saying is I decided to go to China instead of getting an MBA. I’m like, you know, well, actually the real truth is I didn’t think I would live in China, but I was buying from China and I was networking on my space.

There was no Facebook. [00:56:00] I was talking to other bar product sellers on e commerce. And they also needed help buying from China. And MySpace messages, crazy dude. Everybody’s like, thinks I’m some stalker using MySpace, but there was a lot of business people on MySpace. Making their business pages and promoting their businesses on MySpace.

I was talking to a lot of them in my industry. And they’re like, oh, you can help us buy from China, you can help us buy from China. So I even started doing that while I was in New York City. I was doing that while I was in New York City. And… And I was buying it [00:56:30] for myself, but I felt like a hypocrite because I barely knew how to buy from China.

Right. Like I was, how was I that much better than they were, you know, so I felt like I had to go to China. Now, like I’m getting some, I was doing trades with them. I stayed up late on Alibaba and Skype, you know, and like 10 o’clock at night on Skype with Chinese factories. So I went to San Diego first because my friend lived there.

And he offered me as a spare room [00:57:00] and month to month. So I quit my job. I went to San Diego and started doing my sourcing, but I got so bored in San Diego. It’s so boring. You know, the beach guy, I mean, it’s nice for a while, but there was a coffee shop. I went to on the beach in a ocean beach. And it was a family owned because I don’t like Starbucks.

I choose a family owned over Starbucks and they were saying, we should just put your name on this table because I would literally go there. I think I’ve brought a voice over [00:57:30] IP phone. Those, you know, the IP phones you could plug into your USB. I think I had the laptop and the phone because I was doing calls.

And they’re like, we should just put your name here. I don’t know if she meant that in a nice way or like trying to tell me to stop coming. She was nice. I think it was a nice, but you know, nobody, it’s just 2007. Nobody else, nobody was doing their own business. I went to some kind of government, you know, like import export society, like some kind of government [00:58:00] meetups, like government meetups about import exports.

Cause there was no startup stuff, there was no tech stuff, there was nothing. So I, I went to China in October of seven, after that summer, and I was blown away in China. Like, I think I said, I thought, you know, I don’t, I don’t, I’m not, I’m not meaning to be racist. Sometimes people got upset. I said this once on a Chinese, uh, TV show, but I said, I thought that they were going to come in rice [00:58:30] fields and pointy hats.

And I’m not trying to be like racist, but I really thought it was gonna be like fields of rice and farmers. Cause I don’t think it was like this. And then I get to Hong Kong, Hong Kong, especially I’ve landed in Hong Kong. I was like, what? This is nuts, man. This is like way more advanced than the U. S. And back then there was no YouTube for you to do research, no forums, no nothing.

Yeah. No Facebook. Yeah, wow. Yeah, so [00:59:00] then I was like, man, I was there for a month. I went to some of the shows and I went to factories and I traveled even to Shenzhen, Shanghai, Beijing. And then it was like, man, there’s just, this is way, it’s fun, but it’s adventure. And it’s like, and there’s so much opportunity.

I was like, I gotta come back. I gotta come back, but I went back for Christmas in 07 and I have Chris, you know, I have a Christmas with my [00:59:30] parents in Florida. They thought I was nuts. Well, they’re already kind of disappointed. I quit my six figure job in New York, but, but then I went back to China, like right after Christmas 07 to, to like find a place and live.

We’ll get to China in a moment. One question I want to ask you guys. I’m sure you’ve all, you’ve won it sometime. How would you, would have your life turned out if you had stayed in New York and kept that job and by now you’d be in a much more advanced position, especially maybe VP [01:00:00] or your own firm, whatever.

Have you thought about how your life could have been completely different? And much probably easier financially, because I know the path of an entrepreneur is fun. It’s exciting, but it’s fast feast and famine, you know? Yeah, I know. You know, I could dig up the pictures. I had my going away party in New York and I was really unhealthy.

I was overweight. That was probably one of the bigger times in my life, you [01:00:30] know, wider times in my life. I could try to dig it up if you want, because I realized that last year or two, I was really stressed and I would, I was drinking coffees all morning and I would switch. I started like in diet, Dr.

Pepper for some, it tastes better, or at least it did. I would drink diet, Dr. Pepper and afternoon. And then I would drink beer or alcohol at night, every day, almost every day, even weekends. And I was grinding hard. I also was doing my [01:01:00] eBay and my website. No, not much, no Amazon there. I’m a little bit of Amazon, but I was just not happy.

I told you I was on antidepressants. I think it even had erectile dysfunction side effects. I remember that the doc and it was true. It was true, man. So, you know, I was overweight. I was on antidepressants. Yeah. I was, I’ve made over a hundred thousand a year and I was like, whatever, 24, 23, whatever it was, but I was just, you know, and I was, yeah, so I had, there was beautiful women there, like, you know, and you know, it was easy, [01:01:30] especially working on wall streets, you know, like, yeah, I mean like, obviously it would be a completely different outcome from where I am now.

Right. I mean, I probably would live in New Jersey right now, probably be married, you know, probably have kids again, working there, making more money, maybe I’d own a house. I have more money in my bank account. But another thing I didn’t really say, but after I went to China, I went back there. You know, I keep in touch.

I would go back to New York [01:02:00] and I would even get back on the trading floor. They’d let me up. You know, I’d get a guest to guest badge or whatever. You know, they were sitting in the same exact seats. A year later, I think I went back two or three times over the first four or five years I was in China, I would go back.

I was like thinking at least a yearly trip back to the U. S. then. And they’re like, oh man, how’s it going? What have you been up to? And I see they’re still sitting at the same desk. I think they have still the same family picture on the desk, you know,[01:02:30]

and they would ask me like, Oh, how’d you, you still don’t need to come back to your job? Like they were so, actually, you know, I guess I should have sold a course of eBay or something. Cause they were asking me like, how do you make money online? How do you do that? How do you do your e commerce store? How do you start an eBay store?

I remember being on the NR, the yellow line and going up. I’m still working there and they were all so amazed I could quit this job and they’re like, I want to [01:03:00] quit, I’m just going to save more money or I’m going to wait. They were telling me this, I’m going to quit too. A lot of people, especially in finance, most people are not happy in finance, you know?

So yeah, I don’t know. I might, you know, a really cool book. I don’t know if you’ve read it. Way of the Peaceful Warrior. You ever heard of that one? I’ve read this at least two or three, maybe even three times. I’ll probably read it again soon. Okay. [01:03:30] It’s kind of like what you’re saying about this question.

It’s like a college kid and he meets some, I don’t know if it’s really a physical person or a spirit or himself, but he meets somebody outside at 3am when he can’t sleep. That’s like a garage worker. And the guy like reflects on his life and he’s somehow able to take him back in time and change and fast forward his life and then seeing him like married, but selling insurance and they show some different styles of his life.

And, but yeah, I don’t, I mean, I don’t think anybody should [01:04:00] have regrets, even if I don’t think anybody should have regrets, but I definitely don’t. Of course I’ve, you’ve seen him, you’ve seen yourself with me and we’ve been through it together. You know, there’s been definitely downs. This is, this is life, right?

This is living life. You know, I had a path some way similar to yours. I was about to apply to law school back in 2007 and then a book changed my life. It was for a work week. Yeah. I started my first business and I didn’t send my application to my family, my [01:04:30] parents. And then, back in 2019, I was in Hong Kong, it was 4 o’clock, I was just chatting non stop with Lucien, we couldn’t sleep, and then I saw I missed a notification from LinkedIn, from a guy that I knew back from way back 2007 when I met him, he was in second year at law school in Ottawa, and I just got a Congratulate this person because they just got promoted to senior counsel at VP, uh, VP at TD Bank in Toronto.

I said, holy smoke, this [01:05:00] guy? Senior counsel, VP at legal counsel at TD? Holy smoke, and that made me really reflect how my life could have been better, but then I thought, do I really want to put in 100 hours a week? I’m doing something I don’t like sure would make much more money. I would be safe from more secure, but that’s not the path I want.

So, you know, I’ve been, I feel you, I feel you. Yeah. But it was life for me. I see life as a, as a, as a buffet. We’re here to, to [01:05:30] experience all kinds of dishes. I don’t mean just the food, but the experiences for me, I did corporate. I did laptop lifestyle. I did oil field that I did football coach, soccer coach.

I did e commerce events. I did now podcasting, publishing. That’s what, that’s what life is for me. Experience as many things as you can. Taste as many dishes as you can, you know. Yeah man, beautiful. Okay, wow, what a story. I’m sure we can do an entire episode just on the stories from… [01:06:00] So, one last question I want to ask about the floor, the trading floor.

I wanted to ask you, but I didn’t, but I have to ask you. How similar, how real… The floor was back then to the scene you see depicted on, say, for example, the, the, the Wolf of Wall Street, that, that movie there, all these guys going all crazy and all these high powered traders having to take, you know, medicine and, what is it called?

The, the drug gluten jerking off five times a day just to keep with the stress and all that, you know, magic say nothing. [01:06:30] It’s, uh, it’s been, I heard now it’s like nothing at all. It’s totally, you know, some of my friends there I still keep in touch with, but I wasn’t. I think it was really crazy whenever that movie came out and I think those are true but they kept it keeps getting cleaner or more and more PC.

So I was there in like, between oh three to seven, and it was more in the middle of where it is now is very very like clean and you can’t do that now, [01:07:00] but I wasn’t like that insane. There was some like. Like I drink a bottle of Tabasco sauce, like a, like one of those like medium sized ones. I always, there was some shaving of heads of once or twice for us, like for new people.

I don’t think it was women. It was like men. There was like eating competitions of chicken nuggets from McDonald’s. They’d stack them up. That was a funny one. So what they would do is. Usually it was remote and it was like honor [01:07:30] system, but it would be like, say our bank versus somebody else, or maybe even multiple, we call them up on speaker and you’d stack them up and then count and see who could eat more like chicken nuggets.

But I don’t, it was not like Wolf of Wall Street. I was like, no, obviously no, uh, no, like, no, no intercourse on the floor. Or I mean, that stuff is, I think even that happened in Long Island. He says not in New York city. I don’t think that stuff happened in New York cities. [01:08:00] That Wolf of Wall Street was more on like outskirts, like in, in Long Island.

But yeah, I mean, especially in the 2000s when I was there, it was not, it was getting more teen, but there was still like that fraternity vibe, but you know, and I think it’s good. There’s more women, not, not, not just like secretaries, but like, like women working there, you know, like, so it had women, but some of them would actually.

Also kind of be like crazy, like the men, but of [01:08:30] course it’s mostly the men that were like the animals, but mostly it was like just picking on the new guys like me, you know, the cup and coming. Wow. So moving forward, you went to China. So you said you’re blown away. Just like I was the first time I went to Hong Kong and China.

And what made you decide to stay? You said you went back for Christmas and you came back in your mind. You’re just, you were obsessed. Just like me. How can I, when can I come back? And when you finally came back, you went back to Shenzhen and you went to Shanghai and [01:09:00] tell us about your path. Get established in China.

Initially. So the story is. I think even before I traveled to China, I was, I guess what I had done is I rented a room from a friend, Peter in San Diego. After quitting New York city, wall street, George bank job, I went to there, I went to, and I was month to month. He says, just give me a month’s notice. If [01:09:30] you want to move out, no problem.

Just give me a, give me some time to find somebody else to rent that room. So I was like, I was going to go to the trade shows in October, right? I think, you know, the cancer fair, all these trade shows. for like a month. I booked like a four week trip. In October 07, so I’m like, I’m not going to pay for rent there.

I don’t have anything. Right. So I think I mailed stuff back to my parents in Florida, who had retired in Florida. And I flew to China in October 07, maybe even September [01:10:00] 07 for a month, not knowing where I was going to live after that trip. I think, you know, I have Mike’s blog. com then too. And we could even dig up the archives, but I was pretty, you know, back then blogs was like journals, right?

Then people would just, so I was just. Journaling it, which I kind of miss. I should just do that again, honestly. But that was just like journaling, like, Oh, I’m going to go. And there was like, not sure where to stay. Do I stay in California? When I come back New [01:10:30] York or Florida, that was like my three. I don’t even think I had China on the list.

I went to China. Oh, seven. And, you know, talking about global sources, they always had these con made didn’t have the summit style, but they had these kind of like, you know, like speaker sessions and round tables or panels. Even back in 07. So I went to one panel session and Mike Bellamy was there, you know, Mike, and I think he even allowed us to have like Q& A with them after or, you know, and I’ll, you know, me.

So I remember sitting [01:11:00] with them or talking to them at the, after the end, and I was asking all these questions. He’s like, Mike, you got a lot of questions. You know, I can’t answer all these now because I think I had, you know, me, I have like the notebook and I’m like writing his answers, you know, like really the guy.

Yeah. He’s like, I think you just got to, you could just live here. I think he’s the one that said, I was like, you can live here. I just, it didn’t, it wasn’t in my brain that you could live outside of your home country. [01:11:30] And when I was in, in like September, October 07, I was like, I thought I have can only visit somewhere and I have to go back to where I’m based.

I thought I had to like change my, I just had no idea, to be honest. I just, he’s like, yeah, you can live in China. You can just stay there. And that was like, obviously like towards the early part of my trip in Hong Kong. And I went to Shenzhen, Shanghai, Beijing, meeting different business contacts. And it was also a crazy, crazy, you know, some [01:12:00] people hate it.

Right. Some people think it’s, it’s chaotic and annoying and they can’t wait to get out. But I think, you know, me, I love that. You know, I mean, I kind of, especially when you were younger, maybe now it’s not as fun for me, but, but, yeah, I went back to the U. S. because actually, the other thing is I changed my flight.

I push it back for 1 more week. I remember writing a blog post about it in some hotel in Beijing. I was like, I’m staying another week. There’s still so much to do here. I got more meetings signed up.[01:12:30]

So I think I stayed five weeks in China and like an extra week in Beijing because I only left like two or three days in Beijing. There’s just so much to see and do. And I was, I’m talking about, man, I would contact companies off of Yahoo finance on there because they’d have the investor relations and I would contact them and I was arranged meetings, you know, like.

And I met these people in Beijing, you know, like I was, I was going to do a tech startup. I did actually do a tech startup in China, but I thought I was going to do it sooner. So I was talking to these tech companies [01:13:00] in the coffee shops and they took me around their companies and especially then no foreigners went to, not many went there and contacted them and met them.

Right. So I went back to the U S and yeah, I felt bad about leaving my parents and my, but I, you know, I wasn’t seeing them that much. I wasn’t, I didn’t have, I, I can go anywhere. I can go anywhere I could. I was thinking about staying in Florida, maybe near my parents. So I was thinking about going back to New York, but I’m like, it’s so expensive there and I’m trying to get trapped.

I thought I [01:13:30] felt like if I go back to New York City or New Jersey or up, I’m gonna get stuck and burn my money and not, you know, and then have to work again. I was like, I don’t want to go back. I don’t want to go back. I know that’s well, I may not know, but I felt like if I live in New York city and I, I was making a couple thousand a month from my e commerce business and we’re actually had a couple of partners.

We were splitting it. You know, so I was like, I was able to live off that in California because I was renting a room for 400 a month on the beach [01:14:00] in Ocean Beach, well, two blocks from the beach, Ocean Beach, 400 a month, month to month. And I was eating like California burritos. I could have gone back to California at that time, you know, a couple thousand a month.

I remember I didn’t want to get the insurance. My mom is, I think, so scared for me, I had no insurance. But insurance was like 800 a month. It’s called Cobra. I’m sure people at least in 07. I was like, I don’t [01:14:30] want to get Cobra. And it doesn’t even cover you. It’s just like, if you go to an emergency room or something, right?

Like you’re about to die. You’re young. So you don’t need to have like, you know, coverage. You feel like 60, 70, maybe. Yes. But back then in the twenties, you don’t need. Yeah, but everybody’s scared of me. So you need it. But so anyways, I just felt like, you know, after that trip and after what Mike Bell, me has said, and others, there was others, I was meeting, there were foreigners that were living in different parts of China.

I was like, there was a whole wave of [01:15:00] these people like before us to like, not computer people, right? I don’t know if you met them, but I met a lot of those like, use

Skype on their computer. And that was it maybe Excel. Right. That was. That was those guys, they didn’t know internet websites like us, right? That was the first generation of foreigners there, like, kind of like the pioneers. And I was like, maybe the second generation that knew, like, web and marketing and e [01:15:30] commerce.

But I just, I mean, I just felt why not? And I don’t know how long it’s going to stay. So I think I said, I’ll just do, you know, six months, see what happens. I think I booked a six month round return ticket. I think the most you can book a return ticket, at least whatever airline I was using was six months.

You couldn’t book further out the return ticket. So I booked it. I booked it. And. And yeah, I, you know, I thought I would go back. I think I took, I thought it was going to maybe go back to [01:16:00] America or I was going to go to another country after, but I stayed there, like, you know, I could go on longer, but yeah, I kept staying there.

You were based where, the first time you were based where? Oh, Shenzhen. I picked Shenzhen because I was on a tourist business visa. So I only had like a 30 day stay and I didn’t want to fly out. And there was a lot of entrepreneurs like us. There because of that, if you noticed, I don’t know if you would agree with me now, but I love your input, but I felt like in Shanghai, Beijing, the expats were more like [01:16:30] working for companies.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. I think it’s because of the visa. They couldn’t stay long term without like a work. But in Shenzhen, there was all these hustlers, maybe at least even in Guangzhou in the South because of that, because they would just bounce to Hong Kong and bounce back and it was cheap, right?

Oh yeah. So there was tons of people like us that were like hustlers, like import, export, trader, e comm, small business owners that were like renting a decent apartment for a [01:17:00] good, really good rates. And you know, like that. So I picked Shenzhen mostly because of that because of the weather. So most entrepreneurs go to China, at least back then they, they started first teaching.

Did you do any teaching in the beginning? No. I mean, I had my savings and I was already doing my own e commerce, so I just, I even hired somebody, Melissa, I met at the Hong Kong trade show from the booth. She was like [01:17:30] a translator at the booth or interpreter. And I got her MSN messenger, remember MSN messenger?

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I don’t know why some people use MSN or Skype, but there was, I, we talked on MSN.

I think it got rolled into some Skype. I think, I think it’s Skype, Microsoft merged them or something, but back then, of course, but no, no, I, I, I was also, um, you know, no disrespect to teachers, but I was like, [01:18:00] Not, not interested to do that. I mean, of course that’s an option, but no. Yeah. I hear you. And then another big event in your life is how did you meet Wendy?

Your future, your future wife. Yeah, so I mentioned a little bit about doing tech startup. I always want to try to do something in China for tech. I’m definitely a sucker for punishment. And I went through a China accelerator program [01:18:30] and it was up in Dalian, which is the Northeast, somewhat near Beijing.

And then it was a three month program in 2012. Mostly foreigners were building tech companies in China, which is insane. And I contacted her on the CNOTE Weibo or like a Chinese Twitter. Actually, it was my startup. We did lead generation, which was basically just like LinkedIn, right? You can’t contacting people, mass contacting.

[01:19:00] And I, she worked at a mobile app. Company in biz dev. So she was one of my leads and we had actually, it was really effective strategy because I was a foreigner. We, it was my personal profile and the English, the message was in English. It says like, hi, I am doing a tech startup and I’m looking for companies in Beijing to cooperate with.

I will be in Beijing from October 10th to October [01:19:30] 13th or whatever. I’m just saying like, it was a message like this. Like I like to arrange a meeting to cooperate with your company. I’m doing it. A new tech startup, et cetera, because I was trying to get more guanxi or relationships in the tech. So actually it was a really good response rate.

It sticks out because there’s all Chinese people mostly on it. And yeah, she, she was replying and then we met yeah. For business in Beijing in 2012 [01:20:00] and. She, you know, was really amazed that there’s this crazy foreigner doing a tech company in China, like kind of like as I was also like, not like I wasn’t like I was a CEO, like main partner, you know, so it was like totally crazy and, you know, she’s very supportive.

And like I maybe said earlier about like girls and dating in the past that would not be supportive of my business or my work. They felt like it was a competitor to them. She was the opposite. She always embraced. [01:20:30] My hard work and supported me and, and, you know, allowed me to do those things and, uh, That was the one part I remember about her being so supportive.

And yeah, of course we got to know each other and she’s also very independent. She was showing me her trip to, I think it was Tibet or somewhere in the Western China. And she was showing how she traveled and grew by herself. And that was like a very independent partner. I don’t like people that are [01:21:00] dependent on me or.

That was another thing thing I had with previous women I dated is they were wanting to be like dependent on me, you know, and she’s very independent. I think, you know, too, if you’ve met her, but yeah, it’s one thing I’ve learned about dating is learning. I told this recently at a conference because somebody was talking about dating and finding the right spouse.

It’s not only about what you want in a person. It’s, I think almost more important [01:21:30] what you don’t want. Absolutely. Usually the breakups, the divorces or whatever is not about the, you know, no matter how good the good stuff is, if there’s some big bad ones that are really hard for you to accept or live with, that’s the reason, you know?

Absolutely. So how soon did the relationship move from business to dating between you guys initially? Yeah, it was pretty fast to be honest. You know, I was going to Beijing quite a Dalian and. [01:22:00] You know, back in the good old, those are the good old days of China, right? And when foreigners were more welcomed, at least the feeling is, but I think you and I agreed, we don’t feel welcomed there right now.

So they were very welcoming and accommodating about events. And so I was coming there. It was only like a, it was actually a train ride from Dalian, if anybody knows, but it was a train ride. I would take the China train, but yeah, I mean, within a few weeks, you know, we really [01:22:30] started to talk a lot on chats and I would have visitor in Beijing and I was going to like these startup events and we had a demo day for the program in Beijing.

And again, like she took a day off from her work and she helped us with the booth. We had booth set up there. For the people at the event and it was really, yeah, I mean, within just like a, like a month or so, we really, and then by the end of the program, what happened was I went back to Shenzhen [01:23:00] cause it’s kind of where I was maybe based.

And then she was trying to convince me as well as others were saying, if you really want to do a tech startup in China, you gotta live in Beijing, but I didn’t really want to live in Shenzhen.

And then she decided, we both decided for her to move to Shenzhen. And that of course is a big move. And that was like the end of 2012 or so, if I recall correctly. So when did you realize that, Hey, [01:23:30] she’s the one. Like I said, it was pretty soon, pretty fast. Like even in the first meeting, cause like I said, she was, she worked with the CEO of this company.

She wasn’t a partner, but she was like an early employee. So she saw the ups and downs of startups. She was supportive. She was, she was also helping me, you know, meet people. And I remember she had the photos of her trip to Tibet. And I just remember these, these were like, I wasn’t, [01:24:00] of course, looking for a relationship, especially in the middle of a startup, because I’m so, you’re so busy, but she was checking those boxes, like supportive, not like making my work competitor to her, you know, and independent traveling alone, like she went to Tibet adventure, she was like, so I felt like it was, uh, Very early on.

I had that feeling like I’m ever seen her to the first time and getting that kind of [01:24:30] feeling Beautiful, beautiful. Wow. What a story Mike and we have just barely scratched the surface so much more We can do an entire not just a bit of an entire season just on your experience in China There’s so much we can say about I live for is in China one year on Kong He lived how long he lived in China was since 2007.

So that’s what almost 17 years 17 18 A lifetime almost. Wow. I mean, there’s been some Thailand now and there was a little bit of back and forth with Philippines. I think a lot of us kind of needed trying to [01:25:00] break, but yeah, I mean, I definitely haven’t been in the U S I mean, I visited maybe for a few weeks at a time, but yeah.

Mostly China, a little bit of Thailand last few years. You mentioned the good old days of China back in 2006, seven, eight people being friendly, open, welcoming. I didn’t experience that. My first time was in 2012 and I was blown away how people are friendly. Then I came back in 2015 as a football coach, still people are friendly.

I was based in Hangzhou, but I can only imagine, this is one of my things, you know, I [01:25:30] wish I had done earlier, go to China back in the early 2000s. It was a crazy, wild world, East. I know people who’ve been to China at that time and now they’re telling incredible stories. They made it big in life. But it was meant to be for me.

But yeah, China was, I had a great time in China. I had an amazing time, actually. I met some really good people. Yeah. And honestly, I’m looking forward to going back to China as soon as it’s viable again. I agree. I agree. I agree. [01:26:00] Yeah. I agree. Yeah. Awesome. Listen, listen, Mike, we’re going to call it here for part one.

There’s so much more we can do. We will talk about, and we can cover on part two. We’re going to talk about more, dive deeper into China, your business, your conferences, your impact on good stuff. For now, we’re going to call it a day. If someone wants to connect with you, what’s the best way to do so? Sure.

If they like the personal stuff, Mike’s blog. com, you know, I put kind of like video [01:26:30] blogs and personal updates there. You can even dig back to the, some of these things I mentioned on the business side of global from Asia. com is the podcast and kind of business related projects. I do. And I see you have a, you’re an event coming soon.

We’re going to talk about that more in detail. Yeah. Of course. Yeah.

Yeah. A little bit. What is it? Cross border summit. com. Yeah. It’s you’ve, you’ve been to at least one or two yourself. It’s first [01:27:00] time in first time in Chiang Mai. We’re bringing out of China this year on November 15, 16, 17th here in Chiang Mai at 2023. So it’ll be intense. You’ve been there like multi, like multiple speakers back to back networking after parties, like crazy amount of networking and learning.

I’m currently based in Vietnam in Da Nang. So I might pop into to Chiang Mai at the time. So I’ll let you know. Well, that’d be really amazing. Awesome. All right, brother. I salute you. Keep shining your [01:27:30] light. Keep blessing the world with your presence, your impact, everything you’re doing. I’m looking forward to part two.

Take care. Have a wonderful day. Take care. Cheers. And thank you to our sponsor, our returning sponsor, mercury. com online bank. Well, it’s a real bank, but you can totally online for us. Our blimp program participants are going through this as well. Thank you, Mercury. Travis is great. There’s been on our shows, been in our events.

We’re going to have another event where we will have them. And if you want to get a little bonus for you and us, if you sign up and do some special [01:28:00] circumstances, you can go to globalformation. com slash Mercury. I also have a video tutorial that we use even for the Blimp people. I use the same exact video to learn how to use it.

I hope you can check it out. Totally free. Why not? See you there. Thank you so much to Lorenzo. He’s got a great show, you know, and I’m happy I inspired him with, I inspired him with starting a podcast. That’s so amazing and in the next show we actually already recorded part two, but in part two He talks [01:28:30] more about how he loves podcasting and content creation So it’s amazing to hear that so i’m walking in circles If you’re watching this i’m holding my big vlog camera and walking in circles in the park and Why am I doing that?

Well some of you remember I went to meditation retreat and the monk taught me that meditation is not only sitting in one place, not clearing your mind, [01:29:00] not thinking about anything. Meditation can also be done standing as well as walking. Of course, it’s hard to do this while I’m recording, so I’m not really meditating, but it’s also helpful.

But I can explain the process really quickly as a little outro here. I’m sure this will work for you if you’re watching or listening. Essentially, I, I’ve been doing it in the middle of my day. I’ve been much more effective in my afternoons because my mornings has always been my, at least for the [01:29:30] last 6 7 years, been my most powerful time to get work done.

So the afternoon has always been kind of a, like a siestas, like a lazy, my brain is tired, I can’t think. But when I started doing these the last, maybe a month, it’s given me a second wind in the afternoon. So what I do is, and I learned from this monk here in Chiang Mai, the idea is, I’ll explain it verbally because I can’t show you while I’m holding the camera, but [01:30:00] I put my right hand on my belly button, over my belly button, okay, so it’s a little bit above your belt, and then I take my left hand and put it over my Actually, technically I think I put my left hand first.

I don’t know if it really matters. But I put my left hand first over my belly button and then my right hand grasped my wrist, my right hand’s wrist. The index finger and the thumb is kind of like [01:30:30] holding around it. And then I put the hand on top of the other hand. And then I… Hold that to my belly and he says focus on your breathing of the in and out of the breath and your your stomach Increasing, you know in diameter and decreasing and then when you’re walking You’re not like lunging.

You’re not doing short walks. You’re not like walking in a weird way You’re just kind of slowly putting one foot ahead up until the basically the beginning of the next hand Next [01:31:00] foot and and walking that way. There’s a little more tactics in the temple when I was in the temple. I kind of simplified it In in walking in a park and I also try to walk in a circle So and then I try to have a clear path so I don’t need to worry about falling off of falling off of something You know falling off a cliff or off a sidewalk or walking into a car In traffic or walking into someone else and then you tilt your head Basically, 45 degrees down, just looking, just, just [01:31:30] towards, down, don’t stare at your feet, don’t stare at, try not to get distracted at things, and, and then try to not focus on, on anything visually, or, or feelings, but your breath and your stomach increasing and decreasing, and then.

Just like normal sitting meditation, you’re trying to Analyze your thoughts, clear your mind, think about why you’re thinking those ways, why you’re acting those ways, why you’re feeling those ways and it kind of like Helps refresh and clean up [01:32:00] your stress and your even your exhaustion and I’ve been getting after I do that for about Depends on the day.

I don’t have an exact amount of time but at least 10 minutes to 20 sometimes 30 minutes and then I walk home and When I get back, I’m like, I got a whole new energy, uh, I got a whole new energy in me. So, I can get like a whole bunch more brain focused work, I call it. You know, like impactful work done, not like waste time [01:32:30] work.

And I really recommend it. It’s like a nice little refresher. I don’t get to do it every day, but it’s every day I possibly can. I try to take like a post lunch meditation walk. So I hope that helps. Just sharing tips. Episode 419, Origin Story. www. globalfromasia. com Origin Story 1. Cheers. To get more info about running an international business, please visit our website at www.

globalfromasia. com That’s [01:33:00] www. globalfromasia. com Also, be sure to subscribe to our iTunes feed. Thanks for tuning in.